EV alternatives

[Greenpeace]

Some years back we went through a period during morning peak (everyone cooking breakfast) if we turned on the toaster and the Microwave oven, the oven turntable noticeably slowed and lights dimmed. I think at the time we contacted the Electricity supply and they came and replaced the old pole fuse adjacent to the street transformer, told us it was a poor connection to the very old fuse that caused the problem rather than insufficient supply at peak times. Whatever, the complaint worked. I just wanted a solution to the immediate problem so the truth or whatever was not important, supply problem fixed.!

I guess if lots of owners plugged in their EV's at the same time, there might be a similar dip in supply power. I would be concerned if we had fires develop in weaker circuits.


Ken

We were having the same thing happening many years ago, everything going dim then bright. The power company did some work on the transformer on the pole 50m up the street, but it kept occurring .

I got home from work one day and phew, a very strong burnt electrical smell hit me when I opened the front door.
The supply problem melted the power supplies in the TV, VCR, pay TV box, microwave and fridge, and not one circuit breaker tripped.
Except for the pay TV box, I had all the items repaired (back when you actually got stuff repaired) and sent the bill to SEQEB.

I received a generic letter back saying that "after investigation" they concluded my electrical issues were caused by a "lightning strike" on the time and day in question, and that they weren't liable.

I sent back my neighbour's fax machine alerts, (that had been spitting out all day on the date in question), that all had "low voltage warning" printed on them, and also asked why they replaced the transformer (that they had been trying to repair) on nearby pole number #### the following day?

They sent back another letter that started off with "without admitting liabilty" and a cheque for the requested amount.

That was the day I learnt the power providers aren't our friends.

 

[JoBo]

Did i hear right - the Aussie EV charging company our PM so enthusiastically endorsed not long ago, did go into receiver ship? Does he have the gift of giving companies the kiss of death or doesn't he know what he's talking about (crap advisors?)

 

[2353]

Did i hear right - the Aussie EV charging company our PM so enthusiastically endorsed not long ago, did go into receiver ship? Does he have the gift of giving companies the kiss of death or doesn't he know what he's talking about (crap advisors?)

Could also be that the company doesn't know how to run a business - which is hardly the fault of anyone except the directors.

 

[Russell Hall]

From what I can see with country chargers they do go out of order. So it's not a set and forget business, they need a maintenance team that has all chargers within its easy reach.

 

[michaelr]

From what I can see with country chargers they do go out of order. So it's not a set and forget business, they need a maintenance team that has all chargers within its easy reach.

As with solar panels, and many other niches, there are always cynical "entrepreneurs" looking for quick profits.
I am not saying these operators were of that ilk but you can usually expect a high proportion of businesses entering a new market will fail. When the industry matured a little things might settle down.

 

[David S]

Could also be that the company doesn't know how to run a business - which is hardly the fault of anyone except the directors.

Tritium. In voluntary administration, meaning the directors concluded it was likely insolvent and could not trade on as is. It may come out the other side, but it seems there were product issues, management issues and also a loss being made on every unit sold.
They were manufacturing in AU, but shut down their local manufacturing in favour of a larger USA plant partly to chase US subsidies.
Two interesting articles about it:

Tritium 's rapid rise and collapse is over - goes in to administration - Australian Manufacturing Forum

By Peter Roberts The once high flying electric vehicle charger manufacturer Tritium DCFC has succumbed to a litany of financial problems, with the appointment of voluntary administrators to its three Australian subsidiaries Tritium Pty Ltd, Tritium Holdings and Tritium Nominee. According to a...

www.aumanufacturing.com.au

Australian EV charging manufacturer Tritium goes into administration

After its share price plummeted and it was threatened with delisting from the Nasdaq, Aussie firm Tritium has declared itself insolvent.

www.carexpert.com.au

 

[jaahn]

Hmm a sad story. What might be important for Australia is what happens to their existing chargers around the country. Will they continue to be fixed and kept operational or just stand there in the way of installing other operational units.
Possibly an opportunity for a small canny tech savvy company to get a toe hold into the business.
Jaahn

 

[Kenfuego]

Hot selling a product and getting ahead of the pack and relying on governments to fill the investment and practical business gaps is almost standard in such political pushed environments and EV anything is well into that class, expectation and disappointment in equal proportions.

 

[Greenpeace]

Seems like investing all your retirement funds into an EV charging provider might not be a good idea, it appears Freewire is going belly up too.

NRMA dumps new battery-backed EV charging stations, as another big provider hits the wall

NRMA removes battery-powered fast chargers from NSW site amid reports provider has hit a financial wall, while Trevor St Baker sits in on first Tritium creditors' meeting, and market digests Tesla Supercharger plans.

thedriven.io

 

[Russell Hall]

Urgent recall of Porsche Taycan electrics in Australia because of battery fire risk. Only 19 on the road.

 

[Richard W]

Seems like investing all your retirement funds into an EV charging provider might not be a good idea, it appears Freewire is going belly up too.

This also, of course, comes on top of Tesla also sacking the head of its group responsible for its Superchargers, together with every employee in the division.

How Tesla’s global layoffs are impacting Australia

Tesla has continued to swing the axe on its global workforce, with the effects already being felt by its Australian team.

www.carexpert.com.au

 

[Russell Hall]

Tesla will maintain existing chargers in Australia. Over 60 and about half will charge other models.
Monash Health bans EV charging at its hospitals and medical centres in Victoria.
Controversy over EV's being refused entry to a UK hospital cat park. Allegedly on fire service advice.

 

[DoubleChevron]

Tesla will maintain existing chargers in Australia. Over 60 and about half will charge other models.
Monash Health bans EV charging at its hospitals and medical centres in Victoria.
Controversy over EV's being refused entry to a UK hospital cat park. Allegedly on fire service advice.

I know its "one in a million" but they should not be parked in any enclosed carpark. If there is 5 million of them in the world ... that is five parking structures (ie: airport in uk carpark) that will be taken out. Now if that carpark is attached to a hospital. Its common sense. No very large lithium batteries of any type should be stored in a large building structure.

 

[Russell Hall]

Risks are known, disasters are rarely unanticipated, events aren't unpredictable, it's just that people really don't want to spend time and resources planning for something that may never happen. There's a more popular Australian approach, widely practiced, "it'll be right on the night". It sure is cheap. Used to work in the field. A real Jeremiah, always telling people what would happen if the circumstances were wrong. Monash Health aren't playing the game, they may even have a fire management strategy.

 

[Greenpeace]

Risks are known, disasters are rarely unanticipated, events aren't unpredictable, it's just that people really don't want to spend time and resources planning for something that may never happen. There's a more popular Australian approach, widely practiced, "it'll be right on the night". It sure is cheap. Used to work in the field. A real Jeremiah, always telling people what would happen if the circumstances were wrong. Monash Health aren't playing the game, they may even have a fire management strategy.

I believe pretty well every fire department on the planet is training for, and in many cases purchasing specialised equipment for, fighting EV fires.
Yet we still have EV enthusiasts that insist that the EV fire risk is so remote as to be virtually non-existent.
Makes sense.

 

[Russell Hall]

Piece in the Independent on the threat of cheap Chinese EV's to western car makers. Probably because there is talk of raising the American 27.5% tariff on Chinese cars to 100%. Musk is quoted as saying that without tariffs the Chinese will devastate all western car makers. Emphasis is on BYD and their cheap Swallow, $US12000 in China. BYD is building a fleet of car transport ships. What worries the western makers is the car is apparently well made.

 

[David S]

I believe pretty well every fire department on the planet is training for, and in many cases purchasing specialised equipment for, fighting EV fires.
Yet we still have EV enthusiasts that insist that the EV fire risk is so remote as to be virtually non-existent.
Makes sense.

I posted this in another thread I think is now removed, but it is worth revisiting to be aware of the risks, the real lack of preparedness and awareness, and largely ineffective mitigation techniques ...

There are other interesting videos from the same conference. Here is one screenshot from another on Li-Ion battery fires and there are others regarding high rise fire fighting, Li-ion batteries on construction sites, and more.

 

[Russell Hall]

Informative and rather scary. The smoke/cloud has to be treated as carcinogenic but country brigades don't have breathing apparatus. Imposible to handle - a country tanker carries 2,500 or 3,500 litres of water. Nobody wants to know the risk and from past practice the fire crews will be the bunnies. Well pleased there are very few EV's up country.

 

[David S]

Move to the side and then upwind of the vapour cloud and/or smoke. Think of the vapour cloud as an explosive gas and note that it seems more likely to form with a lower battery state of charge. I think you'd be best to use that limited tanker water to prevent a grass or bush fire starting, not vainly trying to put out a burning EV. Is there a CFA policy? But it won't be limited to just EVs as more people set up off-grid power and fit out their campers with Lithium storage devices, and buy multiple cordless Lithium powered devices - even cordless drills can burn up. Fortunately these fires are rare, but potentially severe when they do (and will) happen as these batteries age. There are apparently no standards for repurposing old EV batteries for home use and there is comment in the video below about the risks of doing so when you do not know the history and ageing of the salvaged batteries. There is also some discussion of how battery packs are monitored and managed. Of particular interest is that it is possible for a cell to be in thermal runaway for minutes before a changing voltage suggests there is a fault. Awareness helps to manage the risks. This may also be of interest to those performing EV conversions using salvaged batteries.

I linked to this video before the screen capture in the previous post and some of the slides are quite dense, so it may help to enlarge the player and stop it from time to time to read some of the slides.

 

[Russell Hall]

America has gone ahead and imposed tariffs of 100% on Chinese EV's as well as heavy tariffs on some other Chinese products. The era of free trade America once extolled would seem to be ending. How the mighty have fallen. Once the American motor industry dominated the world with efficiency, innovation and low price. The European motor industry survived only by tariff protection. Now an American EV industry can only survive against a more technically advanced and efficient Chinese industry by tariffs. Low wages are no longer the issue. Chinese car workers are paid better than the workers in the American car factories in Mexico.